nine
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Post by nine on Aug 20, 2010 8:25:09 GMT -5
To take the spotlight of Paul a bit, here's a George thread.
Of George's Apple albums I consider this 2nd after All Things Must Pass. It really surprises me that this album gets the bad rap it gets. Simply Shady, So Sad, It Is He, Far East Man, Dark Horse, Maya Love...
Okay there's only nine songs but that was the format back then... nine to eleven tracks...
I've listened and listened to Material World and the dismal depressing Texture over and over but there is very little that stands out apart from Give Me Love and You (and maybe This Guitar and World Of Stone).
Thoughts?
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Post by stavros on Aug 20, 2010 16:24:19 GMT -5
George's voice is poor on this album and the production is very mid 70s and not very polished. I much prefer Cloud 9, George Harrison and Brainwashed before this album.
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nine
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Posts: 840
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Post by nine on Aug 20, 2010 23:49:07 GMT -5
George's voice is poor on this album and the production is very mid 70s and not very polished. I much prefer Cloud 9, George Harrison and Brainwashed before this album. I meant his Apple albums.... All Things Must Pass Material World Dark Horse Texture
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Post by John S. Damm on Aug 21, 2010 10:56:48 GMT -5
For nine's series of "Spotlight" albums *, I played Dark Horse last night for the first time in maybe five years. There are some nice surprises but ultimately this is an album that cried to be shelved, re-recorded after the tour when George got his voice back and with perhaps one or two more "real" songs added. The foundation of a great album is here but it never gets close to being a great album because George had to rush release it for a tour. We know that George was an artist who needed time, and lots of it, to create good albums. George was a notoriously slow worker and when rushed, out pops a Dark Horse. 1, Hari's On Tour(Express): Weak start to an album. Oh, this is pleasant enough but it should have been buried in the middle of the album or maybe tagged on a really strong song to finish the album. Why do horns on Stones' albums sound so full and powerful but on George Harrison albums the horns sound so thin and wimpy(and on John Lennon albums, slowed down and sickly)? Bad omen to start the album. 2. Simply Shady: An interesting track with some of the better guitar playing on a George solo album but I was disappointed to see that Hari was joined on guitar here by Robben Ford so who knows who is doing what. This is one of the songs on DH that had much better potential if George could have had his voice back although we now slam Ringo for dropping in his songs Beatles' song titles and George let's us know more than once that he has a connection to the band that gave us "Sexy Sadie." The other downer thing is the preaching here about getting drunk and chasing whores: while the Stones would revel and boast about such exploits, George admits to them but then goes on a bummer, Hare Krishna inspired sermon on their dangers. George, dude, sit back and enjoy it. No wonder your 1974 tour bummed out most teenagers and young adults. 3. So Sad: Wow, here's one I wish George would have tweaked a little more once he had his voice back. In spots I thought the guitar work was as contemporary to the 1970's as any guitar playing George ever did(and he is doing all the guitars on this song) as there are places where this could be Led Zeppelin(not blistering solos but the repeated riffs throughout the song). Yet the refrain of, "So sad, so bad, so sad, so bad," is so lame. As I say, a little tweaking and if George had his voice this could be one of his best songs ever. It isn't though as it stands. 4. Bye Bye, Love: Awful, this is a train-wreck. Not funny, not moving, draws no sympathy to George just contempt. George could have done a killer cover of this Everly Brothers' classic that expressed sincerely whatever sorrow George had at his failed marriage but he released instead a self-pitying piece of crap. Are Eric Clapton and Pattie Boyd on this song or not? George's handwritten liner notes state that they are but many other sources I have read said that they are definitely not, part of George's semi-sick joke. Whatever! 5. Maya Love: Another song with potential that doesn't ever leave the ground. This should have been tweaked and re-recorded when George had a voice. 6. Ding Dong, Ding Dong: LOL! An album is lame when the opening notes of this song caused me a slight rush of excitement but quickly I remembered that it was this song and went back to my cloud. 7. Dark Horse: Here is a great song ruined by George's lack of voice. What should have been George's solo anthem becomes the anchor around his neck taking him deeper down into the sea. Find the live version from Japan if you want to dream about what could have been. 8. Far East Man: Another song of potential not realized here. 9. It Is "He"(Jai Sri Krishna): Good lord, what twee, pseudo-Eastern, pretentious rubbish. This is where "Hari's On Tour" goes and this crap goes to the vaults for Dhani and Olivia to stew over 35 years later. Wasted potential here and what we do get is embarrassing since it comes from an ex-Beatle. Oh, and the sonics are absolutely terrible on this c.d. from Capitol Records. Not that killer sonics would save this album but it wouldn't hurt. I will not play Dark Horse again until there is a re-issued version remastered and maybe remixed. * Just FYI, since nine does his "Spotlight" album series on Beatles and solo Beatles albums, I think it okay for the solo albums to be here, in the general Beatles section just as ones for group albums would be. It is part of a "Spotlight" series featuring both group and solo projects and should have one home for continuity. When Dark Horse is finally re-issued(if the Harrisons have the heart!), discussions of that new product should be in the George Harrison section.
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Post by stavros on Aug 21, 2010 13:28:12 GMT -5
George's voice is poor on this album and the production is very mid 70s and not very polished. I much prefer Cloud 9, George Harrison and Brainwashed before this album. I meant his Apple albums.... All Things Must Pass Material World Dark Horse Texture Yes I didn't read the opening post fully did I Although I think this is as mediocre as a Beatles solo album can get. George's voice was destroyed and consequently destroys any chance of this become anything beyond an album of poorly produced filler and a few that simply never realise their potential.
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Post by John S. Damm on Aug 22, 2010 11:27:40 GMT -5
I will not play Dark Horse again until there is a re-issued version remastered and maybe remixed. Last night the Wife was off doing stuff with her sisters so I could play the stereo in other than "hushed" mode. I still had Dark Horse out so it got a second, louder play. I pretty much stand by my earlier review but I do concede that large amounts of lager and ale(I was dipping into my mixed assortment in the spare fridge) do what even improved sonics can't: make DH more tolerable. I was in a pretty foul mood last night and legally impaired(I did not leave the house) so "Simply Shady" and "So Sad" seemingly spoke to me at high volume. As my late grandmother might have said, "That was the booze talkin'!" ;D Yet, I always make a note of, and remember, music that moves me when I am three sheets to the wind. Good music to return to when in such a state. Accordingly, Dark Horse could be my new "go-to" album when I'm pissed both in the American and British senses!
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Post by Joe Karlosi on Aug 22, 2010 16:03:42 GMT -5
Last night the Wife was off doing stuff with her sisters so I could play the stereo in other than "hushed" mode. I still had Dark Horse out so it got a second, louder play. I enjoyed your analysis of the DARK HORSE album, JSD. It's never been a favorite of mine, by any means. But I must say that the song Dark Horse, for me, actually benefits from the scratchy quality of George's voice. But I'm sure that's only because it's how I'm used to hearing it all these years.
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Post by John S. Damm on Aug 22, 2010 16:36:02 GMT -5
Last night the Wife was off doing stuff with her sisters so I could play the stereo in other than "hushed" mode. I still had Dark Horse out so it got a second, louder play. I enjoyed your analysis of the DARK HORSE album, JSD. It's never been a favorite of mine, by any means. But I must say that the song Dark Horse, for me, actually benefits from the scratchy quality of George's voice. But I'm sure that's only because it's how I'm used to hearing it all these years. "Dark Horse" is easily the best written song on that album. You're right in that it is not bad even with the hoarse voice. I would love to have heard it with George's regular voice. I had some good moments with Dark Horse last night on my second listen but after that, I put on the re-issued(and remastered) Living In The Material World and man, that sounded like Abbey Road or SPLHCB compared to DH!
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Post by Snookeroo on Aug 22, 2010 20:51:30 GMT -5
I like this album enough to play it occasionally - and enjoy it. His apparent lack of voice doesn't bother me a bit. The album does have a bit of a "bummer" feel, I guess because George and Patty were kaput. A few song comments:
BYE BYE LOVE - weird arrangement. But always fun to hear him say, "I hope she's happy, and 'ol Clapper too".
DING DONG DING DONG - So what, it sounds like something he wrote in about 15 minutes. It still a fun bouncy tune. Nice horns. I have on more than one occasion stated to a group of people that "yesterday today was tomorrow and tomorrow today will be yesterday". It's fun to see their reactions. Try it.
IT IS "HE"(JAI SRI KRISHNA): When I first heard this tune I liked the feel and groove of it. I was also fascinated by the instrumentation on it. I looked at the liner noted to discover that a "wobble board" was making that sound that caught my ear.
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Post by secretfriend on Aug 24, 2010 0:18:30 GMT -5
JSD -Great overview of the Darkhorse album. This is actually one of the few solo Beatle albums I don't own. I like the song Ding Dong, Ding Dong, although the video is at times a bit strange. I think George was going through a weird phase at the time. I do like my "Hari's on Tour" live CD from Ft. Worth, 11/22/1974.
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Post by John S. Damm on Aug 24, 2010 13:43:37 GMT -5
JSD -Great overview of the Darkhorse album. This is actually one of the few solo Beatle albums I don't own. I like the song Ding Dong, Ding Dong, although the video is at times a bit strange. I think George was going through a weird phase at the time. I do like my "Hari's on Tour" live CD from Ft. Worth, 11/22/1974. Hold out to buy Dark Horse because it seems it should be re-issued someday although Dhani sounded burned-out on his dad's projects last I read from him. When this documentary film on George comes out we may get some other nuggets like the re-issued DH and ET. I have that boot from Ft. Worth too and it is interesting.
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Post by coachbk on Aug 24, 2010 17:22:00 GMT -5
I'd like to see DARK HORSE and EXTRA TEXTURE released as a two-for-one CD. I'd buy that. I can't ever see buying each on their own unless bonus material was included. These were both mediocre albums at best. LIVING IN THE MATERIAL is a very good album that got put down on the time because it was not as good as ALL THINGS MUST PASS. I consider ALL THINGS MUST PASS the second best solo Beatles album (behind BAND ON THE RUN) so while it is true that LIVING IN THE MATERIAL WORLD does not measure up to those two, it is still in the upper ranks of solo Beatles material. I do think "Dark Horse" and "You" are very good singles. "Ding Dong" is weak.
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Post by John S. Damm on Aug 24, 2010 19:00:04 GMT -5
I'd like to see DARK HORSE and EXTRA TEXTURE released as a two-for-one CD. I'd buy that. I can't ever see buying each on their own unless bonus material was included. These were both mediocre albums at best. LIVING IN THE MATERIAL is a very good album that got put down on the time because it was not as good as ALL THINGS MUST PASS. I consider ALL THINGS MUST PASS the second best solo Beatles album (behind BAND ON THE RUN) so while it is true that LIVING IN THE MATERIAL WORLD does not measure up to those two, it is still in the upper ranks of solo Beatles material. I do think "Dark Horse" and "You" are very good singles. "Ding Dong" is weak. The older I get, the more weariness I experience, the more I am finding that Living In The Material World is a superb album. The recently reissued LITMW is wonderful, really good sonics and wonderful packaging. A job well done. I played this album last Sunday morning at about 12:30 a.m.(after my second listen in two days to Dark Horse) and I was blown away. I had an epiphany with "Try Some, Buy Some." "Be Here Now" was other-worldly. I guess Side 2 really appealed to me like never before. Side 1 of course is very strong. When I was a young man I really could not relate to this album at all.
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Post by coachbk on Aug 24, 2010 19:36:07 GMT -5
[quote The recently reissued LITMW is wonderful, really good sonics and wonderful packaging. A job well done. Be Here Now was other-worldly. I guess Side 2 really appealed to me like never before. [/quote]
Yes, I was really blown away by this song hearing it recently!
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nine
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Post by nine on Aug 25, 2010 5:05:28 GMT -5
I'd like to see DARK HORSE and EXTRA TEXTURE released as a two-for-one CD. I'd buy that. I can't ever see buying each on their own unless bonus material was included. These were both mediocre albums at best. LIVING IN THE MATERIAL is a very good album that got put down on the time because it was not as good as ALL THINGS MUST PASS. I consider ALL THINGS MUST PASS the second best solo Beatles album (behind BAND ON THE RUN) so while it is true that LIVING IN THE MATERIAL WORLD does not measure up to those two, it is still in the upper ranks of solo Beatles material. I do think "Dark Horse" and "You" are very good singles. "Ding Dong" is weak. The older I get, the more weariness I experience, the more I am finding that Living In The Material World is a superb album. The recently reissued LITMW is wonderful, really good sonics and wonderful packaging. A job well done. I played this album last Sunday morning at about 12:30 a.m.(after my second listen in two days to Dark Horse) and I was blown away. I had an epiphany with "Try Some, Buy Some." "Be Here Now" was other-worldly. I guess Side 2 really appealed to me like never before. Side 1 of course is very strong. When I was a young man I really could not relate to this album at all. What is wrong with me? As a teenager I bought this LP (in the 1980's) but it never grabbed me. Even now aged 143 it refuses to reveal its charms to me. I get more of a kick outta Dark Horse....
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Post by John S. Damm on Aug 25, 2010 8:50:30 GMT -5
The older I get, the more weariness I experience, the more I am finding that Living In The Material World is a superb album. The recently reissued LITMW is wonderful, really good sonics and wonderful packaging. A job well done. I played this album last Sunday morning at about 12:30 a.m.(after my second listen in two days to Dark Horse) and I was blown away. I had an epiphany with "Try Some, Buy Some." "Be Here Now" was other-worldly. I guess Side 2 really appealed to me like never before. Side 1 of course is very strong. When I was a young man I really could not relate to this album at all. What is wrong with me? As a teenager I bought this LP (in the 1980's) but it never grabbed me. Even now aged 143 it refuses to reveal its charms to me. I get more of a kick outta Dark Horse.... Nothing's wrong with you, niner! Maybe you're happy in your life although it is somewhat strange that you like Dark Horse which is George's Blood On The Tracks meaning it is his "divorce" album although it is certainly not the classic that Dylan's is. Me, on the other hand, am not very happy about big picture stuff so George's serious and spiritual LITMW quite appeals to me and now parts of Dark Horse appeal to me when drunk and in a morose mood.
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Post by theman on Aug 25, 2010 12:30:21 GMT -5
Great "Dark Hoarse" review by JSD.
I'd be interested in reading people's take on Extra Texture next, as I believe it has enough strong songs to be considered a George album worth owning (specifically, "You", "This Guitar", "The Answer's at the End", 'Tired of the Midnight Blue", and "World of Stone.")
Interestingly, I read somewhere that George considered ET his worst album. Of course, he did not play any of it's songs on his Japan tour.
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Post by Joe Karlosi on Aug 25, 2010 13:14:41 GMT -5
To be a little more specific regarding my thoughts on the DARK HORSE album, I would say I enjoy four songs. They would be Dark Horse , Simply Shady, Ding Dong Ding Dong, and So Sad. I can tolerate the opening instrumental Hari's On Tour (Express), I suppose. I just don't like any of the others at all.
Like JSD, I feel that LIVING IN THE MATERIAL WORLD is a fine album that's grown more on me as I've gotten older.
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Post by sayne on Aug 25, 2010 16:25:16 GMT -5
. . . I had an epiphany with "Try Some, Buy Some." " . . . Have you heard David Bowie's version. He actually did it live. I think I was the only one who knew it was a cover.
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Post by John S. Damm on Aug 25, 2010 18:17:14 GMT -5
. . . I had an epiphany with "Try Some, Buy Some." " . . . Have you heard David Bowie's version. He actually did it live. I think I was the only one who knew it was a cover. No but you've given me a new YouTube search assignment! The other night I just heard something in the melody, something in George's pleading voice that really tugged at me. I had always dismissed the song before but I heard a longing beauty in it the early hours of Sunday morning. I must say that this specific Thread has opened my heart up a little to Dark Horse even though I was pretty tough in my review of it. I first heard this album in approximately 1979/80 and it did nothing for me, nada. I had absolutely no use for it. I played ET and LITMW much more than DH even though those weren't high at all on my list and rarely got played. Only Ringo The 4th and Wings Wild Life got less play from me(yes, I was not always a Wild Life fanatic, I bought into the CW). In 1979, I absolutely loved the George Harrison album, ATMP and most of 33 1/3 and basically ignored George's 2nd, 3rd and 4th solo albums proper. This spotlight is appreciated, niner. It reminds me of JoeK's "Survivor" several years ago where I really rediscovered Macca II, finding that I liked much of it.
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Post by ReturnToPepperland on Aug 25, 2010 18:23:47 GMT -5
Why do horns on Stones' albums sound so full and powerful but on George Harrison albums the horns sound so thin and wimpy(and on John Lennon albums, slowed down and sickly)?
Neither John or George were very good producers or arrangers.
As for Dark Horse, its a fair album but you can't really compare it to ATMP or even LITMW. I really like the title track, dark hoarse voice and all. Simply Shady and So Bad are good too. Beyond that the tracks do not stand out. I hate the arrangement of Far East Man with all those muffled quazi-jazz horns. Otherwise it isn't a bad song.
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Post by Joe Karlosi on Aug 26, 2010 5:20:12 GMT -5
Why do horns on Stones' albums sound so full and powerful but on George Harrison albums the horns sound so thin and wimpy(and on John Lennon albums, slowed down and sickly)? And I'm sure you feel that on ALL of Paul's albums they sounded "juuussstttt right", RTP?. Of course not. They weren't McCartney, right?
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Post by theman on Aug 28, 2010 18:28:08 GMT -5
In 1979, I absolutely loved the George Harrison album, ATMP and most of 33 1/3 and basically ignored George's 2nd, 3rd and 4th solo albums proper. I had the same reaction to discovering George's work in the mid to late 70s. Never really listened to LITMW or DH. Loved 33 1/3 and GH (but kinda liked ET as well). I can't remember the last time that I played Dark Horse.
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Post by John S. Damm on Aug 28, 2010 22:11:45 GMT -5
In 1979, I absolutely loved the George Harrison album, ATMP and most of 33 1/3 and basically ignored George's 2nd, 3rd and 4th solo albums proper. I had the same reaction to discovering George's work in the mid to late 70s. Never really listened to LITMW or DH. Loved 33 1/3 and GH (but kinda liked ET as well). I can't remember the last time that I played Dark Horse. Until last weekend, I was like you, The Man, and rarely played DH and it had been years. Put DH on when you have your residence to yourself and can crank it(most spouses who are not big Beatles fans sure are not going to like DH!). Being in a slightly altered state of mind doesn't hurt either. Being in a sad, foul or morose mood also helps. Under those conditions, DH is not too bad! ;D
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