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Post by Joe Karlosi on Oct 5, 2010 15:34:24 GMT -5
No, there are no bonuses on the Lennon single albums.
So JSD - I forget -- were there any big changes (other than the clarity) when the 2005 ROCK N ROLL mix came out?
How about with STINYC? I'm debating buying that one again. Do you recall differences?
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Post by historywak on Oct 5, 2010 17:51:23 GMT -5
What does everyone who purchased any of the new remasters think of them? I'm strongly considering them myself.
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Post by John S. Damm on Oct 5, 2010 23:24:05 GMT -5
What does everyone who purchased any of the new remasters think of them? I'm strongly considering them myself. I am listening to DF Stripped Down and it is fantastic! Man, I just heard "(Just Like)Starting Over" and it is like I heard it for the first time. The guitars are so prominent that I want to go outside and do cartwheels. And John's "naked" voice is god-like, I was blown away. I am bowing and paying homage to my speakers. Wait 'till you hear Yoko's "Kiss Kiss Kiss!" It is now pure punk and not some techno-dance 1980's thing as released. It rocks hard and emits dangerous sexuality I find missing in the original. Come kiss me like a vampire, Yoko, bite hard and deep! Here is the clincher: "Cleanup Time" is 100 times better! It rocks harder but keeps that funky groove. I will never knock this song again, as long as it is stripped down. Dr. Winston O'Boogie at his rocking best. No comparison to the original which is lame to me. My goodness, "Give Me Something" is short, not sweet and kicks ass! Great job, Yoko! "I'm Losing You" is a fantastic medium between the original and the "Cheap Trick" version. I think JoeK will really like this one because it keeps the feel of the official version but it rocks harder! I'm going to quit writing and enjoy this album because this is like me writing during sex, I'll miss the good stuff trying to verbalize my feelings. Go buy this folks, it is a winner(and if you don't like it, disc two is the remastered original mix!). OMG, "Beautiful Boy" stripped is like hearing John doing a single-tracked vocal of "In My Life," a Holy Grail kind of thing. I must stop and just listen!
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Post by John S. Damm on Oct 6, 2010 0:07:24 GMT -5
I must add that I just worshiped in the House of Lennon to "Watching The Wheels." The piano will blow everyone away because it is now a single piano track with jaunty playing and John's vocal....it is about the best I have ever heard, certainly my new favorite solo Lennon vocal. I heard shades of Blood On The Tracks Dylan in that voice but basically 99.999% pure Lennon and I feel fine! "I'm Your Angel" is a hoot, a lot of fun here.
"Woman" stripped down is slightly disappointing as it is mellower and it was already a mellow song. I miss the Beatles'-like electric guitars that start the original version as now it is more acoustic strumming but the sonics are stunning so this is still much better than those rough demos we have all heard of "Woman" which are more acoustic too. It would have been perfect if the original electric guitar(s) intro had been kept. It is still beautiful and John's initial pronouncement in the song is loud and clear.
Wow, "Beautiful Boys" here has much more prominent Spanish guitar playing throughout and it makes the song more beautiful and haunting. "Dear Yoko" is jaunty fun, good sonics with a better vocal track, IMO, than the original. I might still like the Lennon Anthology version better but this is better than the original. It is faster.
OMG, this is the definitive "Every Man Has A Woman Who Loves Him!" Wow, this is quite stunning, I won't say more as it is very different than the original. This arrangement does sounds like something Paul might have done on McCartney II or Press To Play but I say that in an approving way.
"Hard Times Are Over" on stripped down will please everyone here with more surprises that will warm your heart and make you laugh, make you cry. There is a Beatles' surprise in this that is worth to me the price of the whole album. It is really warmer than the official version.
I am not blowing sunshine up your _ss_s. I sincerely think Double Fantasy Stripped Down is that great! And if you don't like it, play Disc 2 which is the remastered original. Sean's cover artwork is much better when one is holding the c.d. jacket in one's hand than just seeing it reproduced on amazon.com or somewhere else. The interior cover photos are familiar but in breathtaking color and clarity, giving them new life.
This album will be a favorite on both rock radio stations and those like Sirius Sat. Radio's "Coffeehouse" which plays the "unplugged" versions. At Best Buy, DF and the new comp Power To The People were the only Lennon reissues in the new rack and DF looks to have sold well as there were only two copies left while the new Power To The People looked like it had only sold a couple. It has 15 songs on the c.d. and 15 videos of the same songs on the separate dvd. Just the hits that we all have on up to three or four Lennon comps out there starting with Shaved Fish.
I also bought Mind Games and the classic JL/POB but I have not gotten to them.
This new Double Fantasy is a must-have keeper. If you only buy one Lennon reissue this should be it!
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Post by John S. Damm on Oct 6, 2010 0:18:55 GMT -5
No, there are no bonuses on the Lennon single albums. So JSD - I forget -- were there any big changes (other than the clarity) when the 2005 ROCK N ROLL mix came out? How about with STINYC? I'm debating buying that one again. Do you recall differences? I think RnR just had better sonics but there might have been some remixing. JoeK, buy the new 2010 SINYC as the 2005 remixed STINYC has shortened versions of "We're All Water" and "Don't Worry Kyoko"(part of the live music) and omits almost all of the Zappa songs. The 2010 restores the album to the original line-up and running time!
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Post by Steve Marinucci on Oct 6, 2010 0:41:33 GMT -5
I haven't listened to the full album yet, but the promo sampler had a couple of tracks from the 2010 "Milk and Honey" and they were noticeably fuller than the earlier CD. They originally sounded a little on the thin side, but not so much any more.
I also watched a little of the DVD with "Power to the People." The remastered sound fades in on "Imagine." It sounds very impressive, though I haven't compared it.
I did do a comparison with the sampler a couple of weeks ago. Most of the early tracks didn't sound much different. The "Milk and Honey" stuff was greatly improved, though.
And I'll agree with John. DF Stripped Down is a must buy.
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Post by historywak on Oct 6, 2010 6:46:58 GMT -5
and just for the record (I know this has been asked numerous times) Double Fantasy Stripped Down is NOT included in the signature box? I am considering getting the signature box in the near future so I'd like to make sure I'm not buying it twice.
You guys are getting me excited to hear them.
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Post by Joe Karlosi on Oct 6, 2010 7:48:14 GMT -5
I was listening to a Sunday morning Beatles show and caught the stripped down version of (JUST LIKE) STARTING OVER. I thought it was somewhat interesting, and I noted it was the version with the longer ending. However, it still didn't convince me that I really need to hear or own all the DF songs like this. I've got a ton of LOST LENNON TAPES demos and "naked" versions... there's just something about the STRIPPED DOWN project that is comparative to something like buying a version of a regular Beatles album and turning the right speaker off, or something.
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Post by John S. Damm on Oct 6, 2010 10:44:07 GMT -5
I was listening to a Sunday morning Beatles show and caught the stripped down version of (JUST LIKE) STARTING OVER. I thought it was somewhat interesting, and I noted it was the version with the longer ending. However, it still didn't convince me that I really need to hear or own all the DF songs like this. I've got a ton of LOST LENNON TAPES demos and "naked" versions... there's just something about the STRIPPED DOWN project that is comparative to something like buying a version of a regular Beatles album and turning the right speaker off, or something. Joe, I also got the $9.99 price on MG and JL/POB. DF-SD was disappointingly $16.99 but I think I saw that amazon.com had it for $12.99! It is two discs.
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Post by John S. Damm on Oct 6, 2010 10:56:12 GMT -5
I haven't listened to the full album yet, but the promo sampler had a couple of tracks from the 2010 "Milk and Honey" and they were noticeably fuller than the earlier CD. They originally sounded a little on the thin side, but not so much any more. I also watched a little of the DVD with "Power to the People." The remastered sound fades in on "Imagine." It sounds very impressive, though I haven't compared it. I did do a comparison with the sampler a couple of weeks ago. Most of the early tracks didn't sound much different. The "Milk and Honey" stuff was greatly improved, though. And I'll agree with John. DF Stripped Down is a must buy. Steve, are the videos on the new Power To The People comp the same as those found on The John Lennon Video Collection(which has the unaltered "Stand By Me" performance video from Old Grey Whistle Test) or the infuriatingly altered versions as found on the Lennon Legend dvd more recently released where, for instance, the same "Stand By Me" performance video has interspersed within it now old footage from the 1969 Peace Campaign?? I had PTTP in my hand last night to buy but at the last moment I put it back on the rack. I like the original videos John and Yoko did to accompany some of the songs at the time of their release but many videos had to be recreated from archive footage after the fact(and after John's death) and those interest me much less.
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Post by vectisfabber on Oct 6, 2010 11:47:18 GMT -5
DF-SD is exactly the sort of thing I wish they'd do with the Beatles catalogue. If they did that, THEN you'd see me get excited! (bloody remasters)
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Post by mikev on Oct 6, 2010 12:32:07 GMT -5
I was listening to a Sunday morning Beatles show and caught the stripped down version of (JUST LIKE) STARTING OVER. I thought it was somewhat interesting, and I noted it was the version with the longer ending. However, it still didn't convince me that I really need to hear or own all the DF songs like this. I've got a ton of LOST LENNON TAPES demos and "naked" versions... there's just something about the STRIPPED DOWN project that is comparative to something like buying a version of a regular Beatles album and turning the right speaker off, or something. I had an off the radio recording of Starting Over's premiere with the "over and over" extended ending, so it's interesting to hear that it's on the stripped version. I sort of agree with your comparison. The Get Back version of One After 909 for example plays John's vocal on one side and Paul's on the other. Take one out and voila, you have a Paul version or a John version of the song. Something tainted there, on the other hand, the Rock Band mixes are pretty interesting- same concept.
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Post by Joe Karlosi on Oct 6, 2010 13:03:17 GMT -5
I guess I'll never understand your aversion to them finally releasing the "properly" mastered CD versions of the Beatles' albums in 2009, vectis (the original CDs were never rightly done). If they were to do more standard remasters of the same ol' albums in 2015, then I would agree with you. But the 2009's were needed.
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Post by vectisfabber on Oct 6, 2010 17:55:29 GMT -5
Oh, I agree that they were needed. Just not by me!
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Post by Steve Marinucci on Oct 6, 2010 20:51:22 GMT -5
I guess I'll never understand your aversion to them finally releasing the "properly" mastered CD versions of the Beatles' albums in 2009, vectis (the original CDs were never rightly done). If they were to do more standard remasters of the same ol' albums in 2015, then I would agree with you. But the 2009's were needed. There are people out there who think the remasters were a ripoff. Even with less than top flight equipment, you can hear the difference. It not a remixing type of difference, but it's definitely there. After a year, though, used copies are pretty available at a reasonable price for anyone who wants them.
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Post by Steve Marinucci on Oct 6, 2010 20:53:15 GMT -5
and just for the record (I know this has been asked numerous times) Double Fantasy Stripped Down is NOT included in the signature box? I am considering getting the signature box in the near future so I'd like to make sure I'm not buying it twice. You guys are getting me excited to hear them. Correct. DF Stripped is not. However, Stripped contains a second disc with the original album mix. I haven't done a side by side yet, but I'm guessing it's not the remastered. Why they did this is beyond me.
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Post by Steve Marinucci on Oct 6, 2010 20:55:57 GMT -5
I haven't listened to the full album yet, but the promo sampler had a couple of tracks from the 2010 "Milk and Honey" and they were noticeably fuller than the earlier CD. They originally sounded a little on the thin side, but not so much any more. I also watched a little of the DVD with "Power to the People." The remastered sound fades in on "Imagine." It sounds very impressive, though I haven't compared it. I did do a comparison with the sampler a couple of weeks ago. Most of the early tracks didn't sound much different. The "Milk and Honey" stuff was greatly improved, though. And I'll agree with John. DF Stripped Down is a must buy. Steve, are the videos on the new Power To The People comp the same as those found on The John Lennon Video Collection(which has the unaltered "Stand By Me" performance video from Old Grey Whistle Test) or the infuriatingly altered versions as found on the Lennon Legend dvd more recently released where, for instance, the same "Stand By Me" performance video has interspersed within it now old footage from the 1969 Peace Campaign?? I had PTTP in my hand last night to buy but at the last moment I put it back on the rack. I like the original videos John and Yoko did to accompany some of the songs at the time of their release but many videos had to be recreated from archive footage after the fact(and after John's death) and those interest me much less. I need to check that about the vids. I've been pretty busy with the Lennon birthday stories and haven't had time to sit down with them yet. I will as soon as I can. I did watch "Give Peace a Chance" last night and, as I recall, the LL version had a lot of blood in it. The one here is different and shows various protests (including Sproul Plaza in Berkeley, which we visited a few months ago).
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Post by historywak on Oct 7, 2010 6:23:01 GMT -5
and just for the record (I know this has been asked numerous times) Double Fantasy Stripped Down is NOT included in the signature box? I am considering getting the signature box in the near future so I'd like to make sure I'm not buying it twice. You guys are getting me excited to hear them. Correct. DF Stripped is not. However, Stripped contains a second disc with the original album mix. I haven't done a side by side yet, but I'm guessing it's not the remastered. Why they did this is beyond me. Thanks. Oh and I don't understand what you mean by the bold part. You're saying that it's the original album mix but it's not remastered?
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Post by John S. Damm on Oct 7, 2010 9:01:43 GMT -5
Correct. DF Stripped is not. However, Stripped contains a second disc with the original album mix. I haven't done a side by side yet, but I'm guessing it's not the remastered. Why they did this is beyond me. Thanks. Oh and I don't understand what you mean by the bold part. You're saying that it's the original album mix but it's not remastered? Yeah, Steve's info knocked me for a loop! I just assumed that Disc 2 of Double Fantasy was the 2010 remastered original mix of DF! I didn't think there was an individually sold 2010 remastered DF without "Stripped Down" but that such a DF was only in the new boxset. I have also been thinking that the 2000 to 2005 reissued Lennon(and in some cases Lennon/Ono) catalog will become collector items as some have remixing which changed the music in some instances and there are some really cool "bonus" material like John's very last radio interview on the 2001 Milk And Honey not found on the 2010 remasters. At the Lafayette Indiana Best Buy I was at, the Lennon bin had only the new 2010 reissues, a couple of the recent 2-disc comp Working Class Hero and surprisingly the "old" 1988 soundtrack to the Imagine documentary. That Best Buy had none of the 2000 to 2005 reissues.
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Post by John S. Damm on Oct 7, 2010 12:57:47 GMT -5
I am playing the 2010 remastered Mind Games which emphasizes on the sticker to the plastic wrap that this is a remaster, "of John's original mix" and I am pleased to report that the sonics are greatly superior to the original Mind Games c.d. released August 3, 1987, as catalogue number CDP 7 46769 2. That original c.d. version is sonically dead and really lessens the album listening experience.
Still, John's production style is so muddy on Mind Games. I must say that I still greatly prefer the 2002 remastered version which had to have been remixed too because one can hear certain instruments stand out on the title track in particular where before it was one big wall of sound. "Meat City" though is restored to its original glory on this 2010 remaster and for that I am grateful.
This is the Mind Games we all remember and it sounds much better than the 1973 vinyl record and the 1987 first-wave c.d.
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Post by darkhorse67 on Oct 7, 2010 20:22:02 GMT -5
Hi, everyone...I just wanted to know if the Lennon signature box is really worth the money? Don't get me wrong-I am a big fan and have purchased this music over the years in vinyl format, cassette, 80's CD releases, then the remasters which i loved, specially the remixes as I did find Lennon's original mixes to be too muddy, with less detail. i am not a purist and am one of those fans in the minority who feels stereo remasters were a more enjoyable listening experience than the mono. I found the mono too muddy for my taste; although they sound better on cheaper speakers for sure. I would quickly purchase the bonus tracks from the signature box were they available for download, but I am on the fence whether to spring for the box. Is there a notable difference in sound in say Plastic Ono Band; someone on another website said the hiss was gone off the Imagine track but with it some higher frequencies. thanks for any info in advance.
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Post by John S. Damm on Oct 7, 2010 21:45:20 GMT -5
Hi, everyone...I just wanted to know if the Lennon signature box is really worth the money? Don't get me wrong-I am a big fan and have purchased this music over the years in vinyl format, cassette, 80's CD releases, then the remasters which i loved, specially the remixes as I did find Lennon's original mixes to be too muddy, with less detail. i am not a purist and am one of those fans in the minority who feels stereo remasters were a more enjoyable listening experience than the mono. I found the mono too muddy for my taste; although they sound better on cheaper speakers for sure. I would quickly purchase the bonus tracks from the signature box were they available for download, but I am on the fence whether to spring for the box. Is there a notable difference in sound in say Plastic Ono Band; someone on another website said the hiss was gone off the Imagine track but with it some higher frequencies. thanks for any info in advance. Welcome darkhorse67! A friend of many here, ChuckE, bought the box but he seems rather uncertain whether he should have. He will wait until he plays the disc of bonus material before making a final decision. He thought the book was cool so that was a plus. Maybe we can get Chuck out of retirement from here and tell us himself about the value of the box. He did get it for the good price of $151.99 which may be as low as it will be for awhile. Film at eleven! ;D
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Post by historywak on Oct 8, 2010 16:54:09 GMT -5
So I got to see the remasters today (and picked up Double Fantasy Stripped Down.) Is there a reason why all the other remastered albums of his are in obnoxiously skinny cases? I can't imagine how that must look in the Signature box.
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Post by winstonoboogie on Oct 8, 2010 20:40:25 GMT -5
Hi, everyone...I just wanted to know if the Lennon signature box is really worth the money? Don't get me wrong-I am a big fan and have purchased this music over the years in vinyl format, cassette, 80's CD releases, then the remasters which i loved, specially the remixes as I did find Lennon's original mixes to be too muddy, with less detail. i am not a purist and am one of those fans in the minority who feels stereo remasters were a more enjoyable listening experience than the mono. I found the mono too muddy for my taste; although they sound better on cheaper speakers for sure. I would quickly purchase the bonus tracks from the signature box were they available for download, but I am on the fence whether to spring for the box. Is there a notable difference in sound in say Plastic Ono Band; someone on another website said the hiss was gone off the Imagine track but with it some higher frequencies. thanks for any info in advance. Welcome darkhorse67! Yes, welcome, darkhorse67! I can't wait to hear ChuckE's 2 cents ( hint, hint!).
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Post by darkhorse67 on Oct 8, 2010 23:25:55 GMT -5
Thanks guys for the welcome...I did pick up the Double Fantasy stripped down...and quickly tried to compare A B comparison between the Double fantasy remasters....and could not really tell a difference, but hen again my ears are not what they used to be...I imagine if there are sonic differences, it must be between the earlier albums...does anyone know which previous remasters were remixed...I know Rock n roll was for sure because I never cared for that album until i heard the remix.
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Post by historywak on Oct 9, 2010 11:35:14 GMT -5
So, how do the 2010 Double Fantasy and Milk and Honey albums compare to the 2000 and 2001 ones to you?
I noticed not much of a difference personally (I only heard the 2010 Double Fantasy) but I did find that the 2000 release sounded louder. Was there more compression on the 2000 release than the 2010 one?
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Post by John S. Damm on Oct 9, 2010 12:39:07 GMT -5
Thanks guys for the welcome...I did pick up the Double Fantasy stripped down...and quickly tried to compare A B comparison between the Double fantasy remasters....and could not really tell a difference, but hen again my ears are not what they used to be...I imagine if there are sonic differences, it must be between the earlier albums...does anyone know which previous remasters were remixed...I know Rock n roll was for sure because I never cared for that album until i heard the remix. This gets confusing so I pulled out the 2000 to 2005 reissued Lennon and Lennon/Ono catalog and am physically holding them in my hand(as I peck the keyboard with the other!): 1. JL/POB: 2000 "Remastered and Remixed"(says so in the clear plastic left edge with the title). Bonus Material: Power To The People, Do The Oz. 2. Imagine: 2000 "Remastered and Remixed"(says so in same place on left edge of jewell case). No Bonus Material. 3. STINYC: 2005 "Remixed/Remastered"(says so in Left corner of front cover like others). Bonus Material: Listen The Snow Is Falling, Happy Xmas(War Is Over). Warning: Some songs shortened, i.e., "We're All Water" and DWK(Live Jam) and all the Zappa jams gone except CT, DWK and Well Baby Please Don't Go. 4. Mind Games: 2002 "Remixed and Remastered"(says so in left corner). Bonus Material: Aisumasen(home version), Bring On The Lucie(home version), Meat City(home version). Warning: Great sonics but edited Meat City?? 5. Walls And Bridges: 2005 Strangely does not say like all others in left cover edge in the clear plastic. Booklet confusingly says all remixed in 2005 except Old Dirt Road, Bless You, Scared, and Nobody Loves You(When You're Down And Out) but all seem to be remastered in 2005. Why were those four not remixed too?? Bonus Material: WGYTHN(live with Elton John), Nobody Loves You(WYDAO) stripped down version, John Interview to plug album. Warning: Altered album cover, John's childhood artwork gone, Disc itself has picture of J & Y turning into each other(from STINYC originally). 6. Rock'N'Roll: 2004 "Remixed & Remastered"(says so back on clear, left edge of front cover). Bonus Material: Angel Baby, To Know Her Is To Love Her, Since My Baby Left Me, Just Because(Reprise) with shout out to Paul, George and Ringo(maybe not in that order). Must have, saves this once sonically and emotionally dead album.7. Double Fantasy: 2000 "Remastered" only(says so in left corner in clear plastic). Great sonics! I haven't played Disc 2 of DF 2010 to compare. 2000 DF sounds wonderful. Bonus Material: Help Me To Help Myself(very poignant), Walking On Thin Ice(never sounded better), Central Park Stroll(very short, unrealized). 8. Milk And Honey: 2001 "Remastered" only(says so in left clear plastic edge). Bonus Material: Every Man Has A Woman Who Loves Him(John vocal), Stepping Out(home version), I'm Moving On, Interview 12/08/80(John's last one, compliments Paul and Yoko as his only two artistic partners).
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Post by darkhorse67 on Oct 9, 2010 14:31:29 GMT -5
thanks John...that really does help to know what is what so basically the 70's albums with the exceptions of a few track on wall are remixed; DF & M&H are only remastered....loved your comment about rock n'Roll..first time I heard it was from a friends vinyl and I felt it was always just lacking a certain punch or depth...I could never put my finger on it; until I heard the the related tack on the Lennon Anthology and was blown away! Later when i heard the remix, I felt like they finally got it right...I love the album now and the bonus tracks on there are a must...
My main interest now would be specifically to compare POB & Imagine...and the completist side of me wants to have those exclusive tracks like "India India" that are only on the Signature release...i have never been more torn on whether to purchase a release than on this one-mainly because i was happy with the prevoius re-issues; and because the Red and Blue and the Best of Apple are all coming out this month.
Now; I wish McCartney would have had the signature series treatment...they could have done the first box set with the early McCartney & all the Wings albums from McCartney to Back to the Egg-now i would not have hesitated on that release...just because i think these albums are overdue for an overhaul. And it would have made an excellent box set to have that period all in one place.
thanks John for the track info, I started to pull my releases and noticed the same details just now with the remixed on the corner...I didn't realize how much remixes there were....
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Post by historywak on Oct 9, 2010 19:01:59 GMT -5
I wonder, are reviews of the remasters starting to come in?
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Post by ursamajor on Oct 9, 2010 21:36:46 GMT -5
I just bought the DF Stripped but have not opened it yet. I thought the previous re-issues were fantastic and I can't see how you can make DF sound better.
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