|
Post by debjorgo on Apr 8, 2017 13:49:50 GMT -5
I have many of the boot versions in my Beatles' playlists, in lieu of the official tracks.
Rain, For You Blue, Let it Be ("there will be no sorrow"), Yer Blues (with the Indian chant, or whatever it is, intro) from Unsurpassed Masters, Don't Let Me Down (w/the McCartney squeal "One more time...." from the Yellow Submarine/Get Back Russian/Japanese boot, and I Should Had Known Better from The Alternate Hard Day's Night are all in my Top 30 Beatles playlist. My Beatles Best Of playlist has a lot from "Let it Be" Rehearsals (The Complete Rooftop Concert) album, songs from Ultra Rare Trax (Penny Lane, Aerial Tour Instrumental, Hello Hello, and others), Songs from the Anthology Discs (I love Come Together and the Pepper Reprise).
I love alt tracks. I'm about burnt out on the official releases.
"Alright, we're going to change the tempo a little. We'll do Dig a Pony and go straight into I Got a Fever!"
|
|
lowbasso
A Hard Day's Knight
Posts: 2,776
|
Post by lowbasso on Apr 8, 2017 15:26:54 GMT -5
I have many of the boot versions in my Beatles' playlists, in lieu of the official tracks. Rain, For You Blue, Let it Be ("there will be no sorrow"), Yer Blues (with the Indian chant, or whatever it is, intro) from Unsurpassed Masters, Don't Let Me Down (w/the McCartney squeal "One more time...." from the Yellow Submarine/Get Back Russian/Japanese boot, and I Should Had Known Better from The Alternate Hard Day's Night are all in my Top 30 Beatles playlist. My Beatles Best Of playlist has a lot from "Let it Be" Rehearsals (The Complete Rooftop Concert) album, songs from Ultra Rare Trax (Penny Lane, Aerial Tour Instrumental, Hello Hello, and others), Songs from the Anthology Discs (I love Come Together and the Pepper Reprise). I love alt tracks. I'm about burnt out on the official releases. "Alright, we're going to change the tempo a little. We'll do Dig a Pony and go straight into I Got a Fever!" How can you be burned out on the official releases? They are what made the band the greatest of the 20th Century. Remixing the official releases to bring out more of what is on those original tapes to the human ear is what makes the tracks so superior. Would you rather watch DaVinci flat on his back for months on end painting the Sistine Chapel ceiling, or admire the masterpiece now that it has just recently been cleaned up using 21st Century techniques so it looks it was just painted yesterday? John Lennon once commented quizzically how people could enjoy listening to their studio mumbling and playing as they tried to perfect their songs on records. If the new remix of Pepper brings out even more of the quality of each track, it shows once more how their songs are masterpieces for the ages that will sound as fresh as if they were recorded yesterday. Bootlegs are fine for historical purposes, but the finished products are why we still listen and marvel at a band that existed half a century ago.
|
|
|
Post by debjorgo on Apr 8, 2017 16:59:59 GMT -5
I have many of the boot versions in my Beatles' playlists, in lieu of the official tracks. Rain, For You Blue, Let it Be ("there will be no sorrow"), Yer Blues (with the Indian chant, or whatever it is, intro) from Unsurpassed Masters, Don't Let Me Down (w/the McCartney squeal "One more time...." from the Yellow Submarine/Get Back Russian/Japanese boot, and I Should Had Known Better from The Alternate Hard Day's Night are all in my Top 30 Beatles playlist. My Beatles Best Of playlist has a lot from "Let it Be" Rehearsals (The Complete Rooftop Concert) album, songs from Ultra Rare Trax (Penny Lane, Aerial Tour Instrumental, Hello Hello, and others), Songs from the Anthology Discs (I love Come Together and the Pepper Reprise). I love alt tracks. I'm about burnt out on the official releases. "Alright, we're going to change the tempo a little. We'll do Dig a Pony and go straight into I Got a Fever!" How can you be burned out on the official releases? They are what made the band the greatest of the 20th Century. Remixing the official releases to bring out more of what is on those original tapes to the human ear is what makes the tracks so superior. Would you rather watch DaVinci flat on his back for months on end painting the Sistine Chapel ceiling, or admire the masterpiece now that it has just recently been cleaned up using 21st Century techniques so it looks it was just painted yesterday? John Lennon once commented quizzically how people could enjoy listening to their studio mumbling and playing as they tried to perfect their songs on records. If the new remix of Pepper brings out even more of the quality of each track, it shows once more how their songs are masterpieces for the ages that will sound as fresh as if they were recorded yesterday. Bootlegs are fine for historical purposes, but the finished products are why we still listen and marvel at a band that existed half a century ago. What you said about bootlegs is true about the remasters. To tell you the truth, on most of the tracks, I couldn't tell a whole lot of difference with the 2009 releases over the '80s releases. But I got them, and loved them. They were great for the little bit of brightness that they brought out. Except for a few favorite tracts, I listened a few times and I was done. My comments above on my playlists didn't say it but there are songs on these list from the 2009 releases. And there are also songs from the Capital releases, Naked, and YS Songtrack, not to mention Beatles 1 (the remixed version). ALL of these releases have kept the catalog fresh. To me, alt tracks are right there amongst the best.
|
|
|
Post by stavros on Apr 8, 2017 17:13:12 GMT -5
One thing I took from the Anthology project (jeez that was 20+ years ago!) is that the Beatles and George Martin almost always got it spot on with the final product for an album or single back in the day.
The unreleased stuff was interesting for sure. But other than " "While My Guitar Gently Weeps" and "Long and Winding Road" in their stripped down versions, "Across the Universe" and the variation of "Hello Goodbye" (there might be a few others I've forgotten) I have to say that the versions that the Beatles ultimately chose for their final 1960s output were the best takes of the times.
Then as technology moved on the work on Yellow Submarine Songtrack improved the mixes with some modern production and mixing techniques. The improved mixing and separation is particularly noticeable on "Eleanor Rigby". As it is with the separation of the guitars on "Revolution" on the Love album.
I am not really one for listening to out-takes endlessly. But things like "And Your Bird Can Sing" off Anthology are good fun. So each to their own I guess.
|
|
|
Post by John S. Damm on Apr 8, 2017 17:18:07 GMT -5
Could we be pleasantly surprised by Apple for once?! I ordered the Box yesterday on amazon.com and fortunately had saved my Christmas amazon gift cards and used earned credit card points so I am not suffering too much from out-of-pocket costs. Folks in the U.K. seem put out by the Box price so they are examining the contents carefully to see if it is worth it. Some in the UK are ordering the Box from amazon Italy because it is cheaper. How often do you pull out any old Beatle Bootlegs one owns, like the Yellow Dog Series, or Ultra Rare Trax Series (I bought them back in the early 90's)and listen to all the bad takes of Beatle songs? Once every few years or so? I am holding off ordering the deluxe set until Steve and my other Beatle Guru-Reviewer Allan Kozinn get their advance copies and tell me it is worth getting the discs other than the new remixed album. Outtakes just aren't as interesting to me as they once were. $150 is a lot of money to also hear a band trying to figure out what they want to do with each track...... Good thoughts, lowbasso! I have pre-ordered but I have never been rational or fiscally wise when it comes to The Beatles so why should I start now!
|
|
|
Post by debjorgo on Apr 8, 2017 18:23:58 GMT -5
Of course Naked, the Anthologies, Capitol...etc. were all official releases. I meant to say the Please Please Me through Let it Be tracks. What do we call these tracks? The core releases, the standard tracks...?
|
|
|
Post by Joe Karlosi on Apr 8, 2017 18:40:48 GMT -5
I love alt tracks. I'm about burnt out on the official releases. I'm with you. Nothing I'd love more than to see an ongoing "Bootleg Series" type of thing. Beginning with the earliest 1962-1963 session tapes, volume after volume... 1964, 65, 66, 67, 68, 69*. Something to look forward to every new year or two. Of course I love the actual "standard core recordings", but I've been listening to them for 50 years now and it does sometimes get a bit routine. That's why these days I'll usually reach for any solo album over a group album. Or I would play something like LIVE AT THE BBC or ULTRA RARE TRAX before I play "Beatles For Sale" or "Rubber Soul" -- again. *(Only risky thing is that some potentially rather mediocre material could dent the Beatles' flawless reputation. So this is a consideration too, and likely the reason why the outtakes have always been so carefully compiled).
|
|
|
Post by debjorgo on Apr 8, 2017 19:59:55 GMT -5
I love alt tracks. I'm about burnt out on the official releases. I'm with you. Nothing I'd love more than to see an ongoing "Bootleg Series" type of thing. Beginning with the earliest 1962-1963 session tapes, volume after volume... 1964, 65, 66, 67, 68, 69*. Something to look forward to every new year or two. Of course I love the actual "standard core recordings", but I've been listening to them for 50 years now and it does sometimes get a bit routine. That's why these days I'll usually reach for any solo album over a group album. Or I would play something like LIVE AT THE BBC or ULTRA RARE TRAX before I play "Beatles For Sale" or "Rubber Soul" -- again. *(Only risky thing is that some potentially rather mediocre material could dent the Beatles' flawless reputation. So this is a consideration too, and likely the reason why the outtakes have always been so carefully compiled). I want EVERYTHING!
|
|
|
Post by Steve Marinucci on Apr 9, 2017 19:13:06 GMT -5
I'm with you. Nothing I'd love more than to see an ongoing "Bootleg Series" type of thing. Beginning with the earliest 1962-1963 session tapes, volume after volume... 1964, 65, 66, 67, 68, 69*. Something to look forward to every new year or two. Of course I love the actual "standard core recordings", but I've been listening to them for 50 years now and it does sometimes get a bit routine. That's why these days I'll usually reach for any solo album over a group album. Or I would play something like LIVE AT THE BBC or ULTRA RARE TRAX before I play "Beatles For Sale" or "Rubber Soul" -- again. *(Only risky thing is that some potentially rather mediocre material could dent the Beatles' flawless reputation. So this is a consideration too, and likely the reason why the outtakes have always been so carefully compiled). I want EVERYTHING! On the show, we discussed the possibility of the Beatles doing multi-disc sets for all the albums. Honestly, I don't think they would because they wouldn't go over big. But maybe the response on 'Pepper' will change their minds. (It was the top seller the first two days after it went online at Amazon.) As it is, I would think "Abbey Road" would be a likely candidate.
|
|
lowbasso
A Hard Day's Knight
Posts: 2,776
|
Post by lowbasso on Apr 10, 2017 10:04:26 GMT -5
On the show, we discussed the possibility of the Beatles doing multi-disc sets for all the albums. Honestly, I don't think they would because they wouldn't go over big. But maybe the response on 'Pepper' will change their minds. (It was the top seller the first two days after it went online at Amazon.) As it is, I would think "Abbey Road" would be a likely candidate. Pepper is considered the iconic Beatle album by the general public so it is the one most likely to sell in a package like this one. Especially due to its Golden Anniversary status. Any of the others would likely only truly appeal to diehard fans and collectors.
|
|
|
Post by Joe Karlosi on Apr 10, 2017 10:58:43 GMT -5
On the show, we discussed the possibility of the Beatles doing multi-disc sets for all the albums. Honestly, I don't think they would because they wouldn't go over big. But maybe the response on 'Pepper' will change their minds. (It was the top seller the first two days after it went online at Amazon.) As it is, I would think "Abbey Road" would be a likely candidate. Pepper is considered the iconic Beatle album by the general public so it is the one most likely to sell in a package like this one. Especially due to its Golden Anniversary status. Any of the others would likely only truly appeal to diehard fans and collectors. Agreed, guys. But what does it matter really, when artists like Bob Dylan and Elvis Presley (amongst others) seem to have all sorts of deluxe box set releases issued all the time? Are The Beatles any less worthy than them, or would sell far less then them, really? I don't think so. Anyway, a lot of times in discussions like this, people will say "but would X, Y, Z Sell??". They ponder this both with music as well as certain movie releases on home video. A fair consideration -- except that everything does seem to get released eventually anyway. Not everything has to rake in humongous profits.
|
|
|
Post by mikev on Apr 10, 2017 14:03:11 GMT -5
On the show, we discussed the possibility of the Beatles doing multi-disc sets for all the albums. Honestly, I don't think they would because they wouldn't go over big. But maybe the response on 'Pepper' will change their minds. (It was the top seller the first two days after it went online at Amazon.) As it is, I would think "Abbey Road" would be a likely candidate. In terms of bonus material, the White Album and Let it Be have the most to offer. White Album has the complete Kinfauns sessions, numerous alternate takes including Revolution Take 20, the extended Helter Skelter and the original electric take of While My Guitar gently Weeps, and several ditties and acetates. Let it Be has hundreds of Nagra songs, which now can be demixed and perhaps even unbeeped. Plus dozens of alternate studio takes. It can also correct the Let it Be Naked mess up by including a bonus disc of at least one of the Glynn Johns Get Back mixes, including the iconic stair cover. Last but not least, a Threetle rendition of Peggy Sue Got Married from January 1970. Abbey Road doesn't have much of bonus stuff to offer beyond a remaster and high res, other than I Want You and Here Comes the Sun with restored lead guitars, a solid double tracked alternate vocal by Paul on Oh Darling, the unedited Something Take 37 with the Remember jam at the end and a few alternate takes and loose jams.
|
|
lowbasso
A Hard Day's Knight
Posts: 2,776
|
Post by lowbasso on Apr 10, 2017 14:06:22 GMT -5
Pepper is considered the iconic Beatle album by the general public so it is the one most likely to sell in a package like this one. Especially due to its Golden Anniversary status. Any of the others would likely only truly appeal to diehard fans and collectors. Agreed, guys. But what does it matter really, when artists like Bob Dylan and Elvis Presley (amongst others) seem to have all sorts of deluxe box set releases issued all the time? Are The Beatles any less worthy than them, or would sell far less then them, really? I don't think so. Anyway, a lot of times in discussions like this, people will say "but would X, Y, Z Sell??". They ponder this both with music as well as certain movie releases on home video. A fair consideration -- except that everything does seem to get released eventually anyway. Not everything has to rake in humongous profits. "Not everything has to rake in humongous profits." It does if you are a record company. There is a profit level that needs to be achieved in order to justify the outlay and publicity costs to advertise. I wonder how much profit is pulled in by Dylan and Presley box sets. In today's world, most music is downloaded onto phones, Ipods, Ipads, etc. Or streamed. The days of units sold by CD are about over in terms of profitability. Box sets of older artists are collectibles for older generations mostly, and do not rack up large sales among the youth like contemporary artists do through downloading or streaming. I'd love to have every Beatle album remixed to 2017 standards. The 2015 remixes of songs that appeared on The Beatles 1 video collection were huge advances over the 2009 remasters aurally. But it means laying out money every decade or so for the whole catalogue remixed yet again. 20 years from now, 1st generation Beatlefans will for the most part be attending reunion concerts of the band in the Great Beyond, and a huge demographic of fans will not be part of the buying public anymore of upgraded Beatle music. How much of a demand is there now for Sinatra's catalogue to be remixed and resold?
|
|
lowbasso
A Hard Day's Knight
Posts: 2,776
|
Post by lowbasso on Apr 10, 2017 14:09:15 GMT -5
On the show, we discussed the possibility of the Beatles doing multi-disc sets for all the albums. Honestly, I don't think they would because they wouldn't go over big. But maybe the response on 'Pepper' will change their minds. (It was the top seller the first two days after it went online at Amazon.) As it is, I would think "Abbey Road" would be a likely candidate. In terms of bonus material, the White Album and Let it Be have the most to offer. White Album has the complete Kinfauns sessions, numerous alternate takes including Revolution Take 20, the extended Helter Skelter and the original electric take of While My Guitar gently Weeps, and several ditties and acetates. Let it Be has hundreds of Nagra songs, which now can be demixed and perhaps even unbeeped. Plus dozens of alternate studio takes. It can also correct the Let it Be Naked mess up by including a bonus disc of at least one of the Glynn Johns Get Back mixes, including the iconic stair cover. Last but not least, a Threetle rendition of Peggy Sue Got Married from January 1970. Abbey Road doesn't have much of bonus stuff to offer beyond a remaster and high res, other than I Want You and Here Comes the Sun with restored lead guitars, a solid double tracked alternate vocal by Paul on Oh Darling, the unedited Something Take 37 with the Remember jam at the end and a few alternate takes and loose jams. How much of this will appeal to the general public? Most of the above is desired really only by collectors and diehard fans. Will Apple really spend the time and money to upgrade these tapes for those who want them?
|
|
|
Post by stavros on Apr 10, 2017 14:11:41 GMT -5
Agreed, guys. But what does it matter really, when artists like Bob Dylan and Elvis Presley (amongst others) seem to have all sorts of deluxe box set releases issued all the time? Are The Beatles any less worthy than them, or would sell far less then them, really? I don't think so. Anyway, a lot of times in discussions like this, people will say "but would X, Y, Z Sell??". They ponder this both with music as well as certain movie releases on home video. A fair consideration -- except that everything does seem to get released eventually anyway. Not everything has to rake in humongous profits. Do you think the fact that Dylan and Elvis are solo artists make these type of releases easier? Just the one guy to deal with if you like. Everything the Beatles now put out has to be sanctioned by Paul, Ringo, Yoko and Olivia. We have often pondered who is blocking the release of the 'Let it Be' movie. Someone obviously did as it was remastered for DVD back in the 1990s. An opportunity well and truly lost then and again in 2000 and 2010. It's almost 40 years since you could even buy it legally on VHS. It will be the 50 year anniversary in 2020 and I am not even hopeful we'll see it surface in any form then. I would guess that sharing profits 4 ways also cuts straight into the bottom line. I am not saying that is the only consideration but I do suspect some ideas will never get off the ground if the commercial sales forecasts are not healthy.
|
|
lowbasso
A Hard Day's Knight
Posts: 2,776
|
Post by lowbasso on Apr 10, 2017 14:12:14 GMT -5
On the show, we discussed the possibility of the Beatles doing multi-disc sets for all the albums. Honestly, I don't think they would because they wouldn't go over big. But maybe the response on 'Pepper' will change their minds. (It was the top seller the first two days after it went online at Amazon.) As it is, I would think "Abbey Road" would be a likely candidate. As the top seller on Amazon, how many orders (in terms of numbers) is Amazon receiving? $150 is a lot of money! Especially for young generation fans to lay out. Don't you think most orders will be for the 2-CD package?
|
|
markc
Very Clean
Posts: 447
|
Post by markc on Apr 10, 2017 14:19:31 GMT -5
Anthology 3's Obla-di Obla-Da take is arguably better than the White Album version. It's finished, more finished than the album. Less self-mocking.
|
|
|
Post by Joe Karlosi on Apr 10, 2017 14:25:36 GMT -5
Agreed, guys. But what does it matter really, when artists like Bob Dylan and Elvis Presley (amongst others) seem to have all sorts of deluxe box set releases issued all the time? Are The Beatles any less worthy than them, or would sell far less then them, really? I don't think so. Anyway, a lot of times in discussions like this, people will say "but would X, Y, Z Sell??". They ponder this both with music as well as certain movie releases on home video. A fair consideration -- except that everything does seem to get released eventually anyway. Not everything has to rake in humongous profits. Do you think the fact that Dylan and Elvis are solo artists make these type of releases easier? Just the one guy to deal with if you like. Yes, I would think it's easier to come to decisions with only 1 person. But I was reacting to the angle of more Beatles Sets not coming out "because they might not sell all that well". (Not because all 4 parties could not agree). Of course I don't know any more that anyone else about the delay of LET IT BE, but the last I heard was that supposedly all 4 parties are now giving it a green light, but that it's only a matter of when and how.
|
|
|
Post by Joe Karlosi on Apr 10, 2017 14:42:31 GMT -5
"Not everything has to rake in humongous profits." It does if you are a record company. There is a profit level that needs to be achieved in order to justify the outlay and publicity costs to advertise. I wonder how much profit is pulled in by Dylan and Presley box sets. Yes, well that's what I was saying. Somehow almost everything still manages to get released sooner or later, with rare exceptions. I mean regardless of whether the company makes a tiny profit, large profit, or breaks about even. I'm telling you, as a big movie fan I'd heard the same argument about certain movies never being released: first never on VHS, then not Laserdisc, then not DVD, and finally not Blu-ray... AND YET! -- eventually, all of these titles (many of them old "B" Horror and Sci-Fi flicks that only a very few select "niche" audiences even care about or remember!) have seen the light of day on all these formats, just about. There are always movie message boards proclaiming: "THIS will never be released - not enough interest or sales!", and yet the next thing I know I have my Amazon cart filled up with so many new 'forgotten' releases that I need four jobs! Check this out. Several years ago when it was said that "physical media is dead", movie studios like Warner Home Video decided to do a MOD series (that's "Movies On Demand") for films that they felt were so old and obscure that nobody would want them anymore, and it was no longer profitable to release them officially; so the idea was they would burn inferior homemade discs ON DEMAND, whenever people would order them by mail. Well, guess what? Now in 2017 many of these forgotten MOD films are actually getting new spiffy re-releases in high definition on BLU-RAY! So I can't wait to buy the cheesy horror Z 1950s flick "FROM HELL IT CAME" in Hi-Def! I thought nobody wanted this stuff? (PS - "Willard"'71 and "Ben" '72 make their first-ever DVD/Blu-ray debuts in May! ). I know, I know, I know - so they have been saying more and more now for around 10 years. And still we got the videos for "1+", and Paul's FLOWERS IN THE DIRT BOX, and soon the 6-CD SGT PEPPER 50TH ANNIVERSARY. And also, there will be vinyl records coming out for many of these (a format long 'dead'). So I'm guessing we'll be sitting here a few years for now having the same discussion... I've gained an interest in Sinatra over the last several years and there have been NEW VINYL REMASTERS OF HIS OLD ALBUMS which are now issued for him. And all of it said to be remastered and preferable to his old 1950s/1960s Capitol Records pressings. And Frank is likely far less popular these days with younger people than The Beatles are. (I think it's a safe bet to say that The Beatles transcend time and generations much better than Elvis or Frank). Believe it or not, the old people who grew up with Sinatra only have CDs; they don't have records anymore - the new vinyl reissues are not being made for Frank's generation! ...I realize that it would be hard to see this if one was not interested in records, for example. But I can tell you as someone who hangs out for hours at his local record store, there are always teens and 20-somethings in there 'round the clock, all mesmerized by records and getting turntables. And they almost always flock directly to the Beatles' records. Again, I'm not claiming that these new physical media fans are the majority; but there are many of them out there and I see them every day in the stores and making YouTube videos chronicling their collections. They're (we're) not going anywhere and there are more every day. Interesting that the vinyl resurgence for youngsters is occurring parallel at the precise time that supposedly "no new generations want that physical stuff". College students and teens were not obsessed with records in 1997.
|
|
|
Post by Joe Karlosi on Apr 10, 2017 15:10:22 GMT -5
How much of this will appeal to the general public? Most of the above is desired really only by collectors and diehard fans. Will Apple really spend the time and money to upgrade these tapes for those who want them? This goes back to what I've been talking about elsewhere. You say these words and I can understand why you would think this. But the proof is right there in the not-so-distant past... Just look at how many times Apple has already spent the time and money. They released: ANTHOLOGY 1 ANTHOLOGY 2 ANTHOLOGY 3 LIVE AT THE BBC 1 LIVE AT THE BBC 1 (Remastered Again) LIVE AT THE BBC 2 YELLOW SUBMARINE 1999 BEATLES "1" CD BEATLES "1" LP BEATLES 62-66 REMASTERED LPs BEATLES 67-70 REMASTERED LPs LET IT BE - NAKED LOVE BEATLES LIVE AT THE HOLLYWOOD BOWL CD BEATLES LIVE AT THE HOLLYWOOD BOWL LP EIGHT DAYS A WEEK CAPITOL RECORDS ALBUMS ON CD 1 CAPITOL RECORDS ALBUMS ON CD 2 2009 CD STEREO REMASTERS 2009 CD MONO REMASTERS BEATLES REMASTERED LPs IN STEREO BOX BEATLES REMASTERED LPs IN MONO BOX US ALBUMS REMASTERED CD BOX SET 2014 BEATLES VIDEOS 1+ SGT PEPPER 50th ANNIVERSARY 6-CD DELUXE BOX SGT PEPPER 50th ANNIVERSARY 2-CD SGT PEPPER 50th ANNIVERSARY 2-LPs... I mean, the list goes on and on - and I'm sure I've forgotten some things too. And do you know what everyone said before some or all of these were thought up? "Oh, why bother? The audience is diminishing, and they won't sell well enough to justify it!" . And some of those releases sold far less than others did. It doesn't always have to be a Home Run. It can be a Double, a Single - even a bunt on occasion. But more always got released anyway. (Only thing you don't want are continuous strikeouts, obviously). It really doesn't take much more than to remember all the stuff that's come out in the past even while people were saying "what's the point?". So this is why I figure it's not out of the realm of possibility for Apple to give us more.
|
|
|
Post by John S. Damm on Apr 10, 2017 15:42:59 GMT -5
I wish every official Beatles' album got the deluxe treatment like SPLHCB is about to get.
As I have written before, I love alternate takes, especially John Lennon songs where we hear his voice before all the double-tracking and effects are added! That was never a problem with Paul who was comfortable with his natural voice(and apparently still is even though it is heartbreaking these days). As we learned from Anthology, stripped down George is pretty awesome too, i.e. "While My Guitar Gently Weeps."
Hey, Macca has released deluxe Boxes and they are really nice to have although Paul really pissed me off with the FITD B-Sides and rare mix songs being download only! People willing to buy Boxes don't want some of the crucial material in download only form! Us Box people love our hard-copies!
I would gladly buy Beatles Boxes of each album for awesome Stereo re-mixing, lots of alternate takes and maybe some new stuff but the Beatles don't have a lot of unreleased studio recorded songs lying around like Prince does!
|
|
|
Post by debjorgo on Apr 10, 2017 20:24:41 GMT -5
On the show, we discussed the possibility of the Beatles doing multi-disc sets for all the albums. Honestly, I don't think they would because they wouldn't go over big. But maybe the response on 'Pepper' will change their minds. (It was the top seller the first two days after it went online at Amazon.) As it is, I would think "Abbey Road" would be a likely candidate. It is possibly too ambitious. If there is a six disc set and a two disc set, you'd want the six disc set. But if it cost too much, you may skip the purchase altogether. This release will need to sell real well. I'd love to see a Meet the Beatles box.
|
|
|
Post by debjorgo on Apr 10, 2017 20:32:57 GMT -5
How much of a demand is there now for Sinatra's catalogue to be remixed and resold? I just bought a four disc Sinatra set called Ultimate Sinatra. It's the same size as Pure McCartney. A nice little package. " Mixing & Audio Restoration by Larry Walsh..." Close enough!
|
|
lowbasso
A Hard Day's Knight
Posts: 2,776
|
Post by lowbasso on Apr 11, 2017 0:46:37 GMT -5
How much of this will appeal to the general public? Most of the above is desired really only by collectors and diehard fans. Will Apple really spend the time and money to upgrade these tapes for those who want them? This goes back to what I've been talking about elsewhere. You say these words and I can understand why you would think this. But the proof is right there in the not-so-distant past... Just look at how many times Apple has already spent the time and money. They released: ANTHOLOGY 1 ANTHOLOGY 2 ANTHOLOGY 3 LIVE AT THE BBC 1 LIVE AT THE BBC 1 (Remastered Again) LIVE AT THE BBC 2 YELLOW SUBMARINE 1999 BEATLES "1" CD BEATLES "1" LP BEATLES 62-66 REMASTERED LPs BEATLES 67-70 REMASTERED LPs LET IT BE - NAKED LOVE BEATLES LIVE AT THE HOLLYWOOD BOWL CD BEATLES LIVE AT THE HOLLYWOOD BOWL LP EIGHT DAYS A WEEK CAPITOL RECORDS ALBUMS ON CD 1 CAPITOL RECORDS ALBUMS ON CD 2 2009 CD STEREO REMASTERS 2009 CD MONO REMASTERS BEATLES REMASTERED LPs IN STEREO BOX BEATLES REMASTERED LPs IN MONO BOX US ALBUMS REMASTERED CD BOX SET 2014 BEATLES VIDEOS 1+ SGT PEPPER 50th ANNIVERSARY 6-CD DELUXE BOX SGT PEPPER 50th ANNIVERSARY 2-CD SGT PEPPER 50th ANNIVERSARY 2-LPs... I mean, the list goes on and on - and I'm sure I've forgotten some things too. And do you know what everyone said before some or all of these were thought up? "Oh, why bother? The audience is diminishing, and they won't sell well enough to justify it!" . And some of those releases sold far less than others did. It doesn't always have to be a Home Run. It can be a Double, a Single - even a bunt on occasion. But more always got released anyway. (Only thing you don't want are continuous strikeouts, obviously). It really doesn't take much more than to remember all the stuff that's come out in the past even while people were saying "what's the point?". So this is why I figure it's not out of the realm of possibility for Apple to give us more. All that above was done over a 23 year period. The Beatles released all their finished albums and singles in just 7 1/2 years. Not counting FAAB and RL. Other than the BBC albums, everything else is remixes or remasters of music off those originals, or alternate takes which for the most part are embryonic versions of what would morph into the finished tracks since they constructed their songs in the studio on tape rather than building and rehearsing them at home away from the studio before bringing into the studio polished versions ready to record. It is like watching your new home or a skyscraper being built thru all its varying stages, but longing to finally see the finished product. After listening to all my dozens of Yellow Dog, Unsurpassed Masters, and Ultra Rare Trax bootlegs I accumulated over decades I realized most of the tracks are just The Beatles rehearsing or trying out versions of their songs in the studio as they teach each other the songs through trial and error. There are a handful of tracks that never made it onto a finished album, and when you hear them, you can understand why they were left off. Like Mozart, Beethoven, Mahler, Strauss, Gilbert & Sullivan, Gershwin, Berlin, Porter, Rogers & Hammerstein, Sondheim, Bernstein, or just about any great composers of any era, the finished products are what stand the test of time and are what we want to hear over and over again. So those 7 1/2 years of Beatle albums are the true gems. Getting those gems remixed or remastered as time & technology advance is of course what we want now, because those finished takes done all those years ago seem to reveal even more greatness as those remixes and remasters seem to magically continue to uncover. That is why The Beatles belong in the same class and breath as the above mentioned musical masters. And none of their contemporaries seem to even match them in artistry much less join them at that lofty level.
|
|
|
Post by Joe Karlosi on Apr 11, 2017 6:12:54 GMT -5
All that above was done over a 23 year period. The Beatles released all their finished albums and singles in just 7 1/2 years. Not counting FAAB and RL. I don't see what that has to do with anything. Times were different in the 1960s; in modern times, bands regularly can go several years in between new records. And it does not cancel out my valid point that some people have always traditionally been moaning "these things are not going to sell enough!!", and yet history has proven that whether the record company hit home runs or just base hits now and then, the product still got released - as they should. If it's good enough for Elvis, Dylan, Frank, or whomever - it is good enough for The Beatles*. (*The one stipulation being that releasing too much sub-par takes or things could, I'll admit, potentially weaken the myth of The Beatles being infallibly perfect). I don't think any Beatles fan (myself included) is going to disagree with you that the Beatles' BEST material was what they released officially in their "core standard catalogue". This goes without saying, and we agree. BUT what does this have to do with the topic at hand? What is wrong with diehard fans getting to hear the Beatles at work, molding and shaping their architecture? Sure, we already have "the cream of the crop", but I wouldn't mind also getting some more outtakes and some alternate un-used mixes and things. There are still some nuggets scattered within those unreleased tapes. For instance, only yesterday I was listening to an album called THE PETER SELLERS TAPE, and there is a very good version of "Sexy Sadie" in there with an extra instrumental bit. Also there was a great version of George's "Not Guilty" which is the best one I have ever heard (better than ANTHOLOGY). We would never have had that gorgeous early acoustic version of "While My Guitar Gently Weeps" if the session tapes had not been used.
|
|
|
Post by Joe Karlosi on Apr 11, 2017 6:24:47 GMT -5
It is possibly too ambitious. If there is a six disc set and a two disc set, you'd want the six disc set. But if it cost too much, you may skip the purchase altogether. This release will need to sell real well. Will it need to? I hope it does (and it already looks like it will). But take a look at any of the past re-releases or first-time issues of anything Beatles-related (HOLLYWOOD BOWL, ON AIR BBC VOLUME 2, THE VIDEO 1+ BLU-RAY, etc....) ... did all these sell real well, honestly?
|
|
|
Post by Joe Karlosi on Apr 11, 2017 6:26:47 GMT -5
How much of a demand is there now for Sinatra's catalogue to be remixed and resold? I just bought a four disc Sinatra set called Ultimate Sinatra. It's the same size as Pure McCartney. A nice little package. " Mixing & Audio Restoration by Larry Walsh..." Close enough! Bingo, debjorgo. Just proof that it all comes out, and other artists get special sets - so why not The Beatles.
|
|
|
Post by vectisfabber on Apr 11, 2017 7:16:42 GMT -5
Personally, I think £100 for the 6 disc set is greedy.
But I agree that this stuff needs to be out there. Nobody says "Look at those sketches by Leonardo - they are a bit rough, he was rubbish."
|
|
|
Post by mikev on Apr 11, 2017 7:48:07 GMT -5
In terms of bonus material, the White Album and Let it Be have the most to offer. White Album has the complete Kinfauns sessions, numerous alternate takes including Revolution Take 20, the extended Helter Skelter and the original electric take of While My Guitar gently Weeps, and several ditties and acetates. Let it Be has hundreds of Nagra songs, which now can be demixed and perhaps even unbeeped. Plus dozens of alternate studio takes. It can also correct the Let it Be Naked mess up by including a bonus disc of at least one of the Glynn Johns Get Back mixes, including the iconic stair cover. Last but not least, a Threetle rendition of Peggy Sue Got Married from January 1970. Abbey Road doesn't have much of bonus stuff to offer beyond a remaster and high res, other than I Want You and Here Comes the Sun with restored lead guitars, a solid double tracked alternate vocal by Paul on Oh Darling, the unedited Something Take 37 with the Remember jam at the end and a few alternate takes and loose jams. How much of this will appeal to the general public? Most of the above is desired really only by collectors and diehard fans. Will Apple really spend the time and money to upgrade these tapes for those who want them? I think Kinfauns definitely would sell on its own. I can't speak for the Nagra tapes because I am not certain if Giles is even editing them with the technology. Having heard hours of these, other than George's lousy wah wah pedal and beeps, there are dozens of complete takes of oldies, old Beatle tunes, demos of later solo and Abbey Road and multiple complete takes of finished Let it Be songs. They could be offered as individual downloads or on a collectors edition. But no, the mass public would not buy those bigger editions.
|
|
|
Post by mikev on Apr 11, 2017 7:54:17 GMT -5
|
|